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Going Beyond Code to Become a Better Programmer – Interview with Pete Goodliffe

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In this interview with Pete Goodliffe, author of ‘Becoming a Better Programmer‘, we dive into issues that go beyond code and separate the good from the great developers. We cover things like attitude, communication skills, managing complexity and what you can do to learn more and keep your skills up to date.

Content and Timings

  • Introduction (0:00)
  • About Pete (0:23)
  • A Great Developer’s Attitude (0:49)
  • Write Less Code (2:00)
  • Communicating Effectively (3:10)
  • Handling Complexity (4:24)
  • Keeping Your Skills Up to Date (7:07)
  • Recommended Resources (8:27)



Pete Goodliffe is a programmer and software development writer, perhaps best known for his software development book, ‘Code Craft’. He speaks regularly at conferences on software development topics and recently published ‘Becoming a Better Programmer: A Handbook for People Who Care About Code’. Pete, thank you so much for joining us. Would you like to share a bit about yourself?

About Pete

Sure. I’m a geek. I’m a developer. I like to say I’m a conscientious coder, making the world better one line of code at a time. I am a regular magazine columnist. I’ve been writing a column for more than 15 years now, which is probably some kind of record, I suspect. My day job, I’m a coder. I work in a really awesome team making fun stuff. I’m a musician and I get the opportunity to write code for musical instruments.

A Great Developer’s Attitude

In the book, Becoming a Better Programmer, you say the real difference between adequate programmers and great programmers is attitude. What are the characteristics of a great programming attitude?

The standout difference between the really good coders that I’ve worked with and the guys that aren’t so great, is attitude. It’s not a hand-wavey thing. I’ve worked with guys who know technology and who know the idioms, and how to do all this stuff. If they don’t have the right attitude they’re just not effective programmers and they’re not great guys to work with. The kind of stuff I’m talking about here, is humility. You don’t want to work with guys who think they know it all but don’t. Being humble is the key thing.

It doesn’t mean that’s an excuse to not know stuff, but just not believing that you’re better than you are. Specifically, being in a state of constant learning, which I guess ties in with humility, so constantly looking for new stuff, absorbing new knowledge, wanting to learn off other people, the desire to do the best thing you can. It doesn’t necessarily mean be a perfectionist and wanting to make everything perfect before you ship. It’s doing the best you can in the time you have, with the resources you have. That kind of attitude really drives through to great code, great products rather than sloppy work.

“I’ll mis-quote Sartre and say ‘Hell is other people’s code'”

Write Less Code

You’re an advocate for writing less code. Why is this and how can programmers actively work on coding more concisely?

Yeah, less code. It seems kind of counter-intuitive for a coder but I think most old-hands know what talking about. It’s kind of the case of working smarter not harder. It’s entirely possible to write thousands of lines of code and achieve nothing in it. Think about it, no unnecessary logic, don’t write stuff that doesn’t need to be said, don’t write verbose code. Sometimes you can stretch out boolean expressions into massive if statements which just hide what is being said.

It’s really a pointless comment, we’ve all seen that haven’t we, code with an essay, and then the function body is really small. Somewhere in the essay there’s some important information but you didn’t need the fifteen paragraphs of comments. No pointless comments, the code just does what it does. The writing of simple but not simplistic code. If you don’t write enough code, it doesn’t do what it’s supposed to do, but just avoiding all those points of needless generality. Don’t make abstracts interfaces, don’t make deep hierarchies that don’t need to be extended, if you don’t need to extend them.

Communicating Effectively

For most professional programmers, development is a social activity in which communication is key, how can programmers begin to communicate more effectively?

Code is communication. You’re communicating not just to the computer, you are communicating to other people writing the code. Even if you are working by yourself, you are communicating to yourself in two years time when you pick up the same section of code. It’s a skill, and it’s something you learn, and it’s something you consciously practice. I don’t know of courses, Uni courses or practical courses that really focus on something that’s really quite an important skill for programmers. It’s something that you need to consciously practice, you need to consciously work on, you need to be consciously aware of.

It’s true some people come out the gate better placed than others. Some people can talk well, some people are shy and retiring, but that doesn’t necessarily mean you are stuck like that. That doesn’t necessarily make you a bad communicator. Some people communicate better in different media and it’s worth bearing that in mind. Some guys are really great on email, they can write concise, clear descriptions, they can follow a line of argument writing and explaining something really well. Other people struggle to put it together in words. Learning how you communicate well, playing to your own strengths, then picking the right medium.

Handling Complexity

What are some ways developers can approach managing complexity in software development?

A key thing to understand is the difference between necessary complexity and unnecessary complexity. The reason people pay us to write software, unless we’re doing it for fun, is because there’s a complicated problem that needs to be solved. There is some level of necessary level of complexity in software engineering and we have to embrace and understand. The problem is the unnecessary complexity. You can take something, a problem you need to solve, add a little bit of complexity, but then if you wrap it up in class design and higher up it reveals itself in architecture.

One thing I know about well crafted software that basically has the necessary complexity but none of the unnecessary complexity is when I look at it, it looks obvious. That is the key hallmark of some excellent code. You look at it and you just think, “You’ve been working on that for a while” and I look at it and I go, “That’s clearly right.” And you know it wasn’t simple to write. When you look at it the solution’s simple, the shape is simple. All I can say is, that’s what we should strive for.

“I have learned the most in my career when I have been around excellent people”

What are some things developers can do to tackle messy or bad code bases?

The most important thing is when you get into your codebase, is to ask people. I see so many developers who just won’t sort of swallow their pride and say, “I don’t quite know what this is doing, but I know Fred over there does. I’ll just go talk to Fred about it.” Often those little bit of insights give you a super fast route through something intractable, a little explanation sort of takes you in there. I’ll mis-quote Sartre and say “Hell is other people’s code.” We all kind of go into that, I do this, and I really struggle with this. I pick up some code, I look at it, that’s a bit dodgy isn’t it. “I really wouldn’t do it like that, what were they thinking, they must be idiots!”

Then my code, I think it’s great. I understand it perfectly, but then somebody else picks it up, they’ll make that same judgement call on my code. What I think is their terrible hack, is actually some pragmatic thing they did for very good reason. When you’re reading messy code, looking at messy code, enter with humility. Nobody really goes out of their way to write badly. Nobody goes out of their way to write messy code, in general. I can’t say that I’ve found anyone that really tried to ruin a project. Approach code with that attitude.

The retrospective prime directive, I can’t remember how it goes, we truly believe everyone did the best they could to the best of their abilities at the time given what they knew, etc., etc. This stops you from making judgement calls, stops you from saying oh, I’m going to rip this whole thing out and start again. This teaches you humility to look a little deeper first.

“The standout difference between the really good coders… and the guys that aren’t so great, is attitude”

Keeping Your Skills Up to Date

The stuff that we work with is constantly changing and it’s all too easy to find yourself becoming something of a coding dinosaur. What can programmers do to ensure that they keep learning and developing their skills?

If we value our careers and our skill sets, then this is something you should really be caring about. This is something I find really challenging for myself right now as well. The things I’m focusing on and learning right now are not necessarily coding-related stuff. I’m challenged with learning management, some high-level decision and tactical thinking on a project, rather than dipping into low-level coding stuff. Which is also really fun, but it does mean that I’m pulled away from thinking about the lower-level technical stuff. I want to challenge myself, not get stale and not become that coding dinosaur.

It’s interesting because I know the tools that I know well, and I do use them regularly, but it is really easy to become stale if I’m not pushing the envelope on my technical skills. The biggest take away I guess though is passion. If you don’t want to become a coding dinosaur you probably won’t, because you care about it enough that you will learn, you will read, you will spend time, you will look at web casts, whatever. If you don’t have the desire to learn. If you don’t have the motivation to do it, that’s when you stagnate. That’s when you become a dinosaur.

Recommended Resources

What are some resources you can recommend for those seeking to become better programmers?

The biggest thing for me, and that I have done personally and continue to do, is to sit at the feet of great coders. I have learned the most in my career when I have been around excellent people who I can learn off of. Whose skills can rub off on me and I have moved jobs. I have moved myself physically to be able to work with those guys. If you have the liberty to do that, do that. It’s joining in those conversations replying on Twitter, blogging yourself, joining the local user-groups, and all that good stuff.

You want to become a better programmer? Again it’s the want to be a better programmer, and just stoking that passion. I’m enthusiastic. I love this stuff. If you have an enthusiasm, that passion for programming, it tells out in the code that you write.

Really appreciate your passion today. We can definitely see it, and we hope the viewers enjoy it.

Excellent. Thank you. Cool.